Riding in the rain.

[Bumblebee]

hahahahahaaa : good one Bumblebee  

yep, im well aware, thats why i stated the tires were almost 10 years old, and were junk brand. They aren't dry rotting yet or anything, but i know they are junk.

Nearly 10 years? They're dry rotted, you just don't realize it. Hardened rubber that doesn't grip, little tiny cracks in the sidewalls or between the treads, bad handling, unstable/skittering in turns or while stopping hard, not flexing properly, etc. If you can't see any cracks, let the air out and push it down to flat then apply a side load and take a look. You're at way more risk than you think you are.

The explody tire was 7 years old and gave absolutely no warning whatsoever that it was about to come apart. Perfectly normal one instant and half a turn of the tire later it bounced my feet off the floorboard and had my full undivided attention. I even inspected it very closely (way more than people normally do) about 50 miles before it self destructed. (The amusing part is I already had replacements lined up 300 miles away for when I got there. It didn't make it that far, I got what I deserved, oh well. Two more tires are on the list now)

make sure they're up to mfg recommendations for the bike (not the max psi on the sidewall)

The bike's user manual recommendation is based, not on some magic number the bike manufacturer came up with for the handling of the bike. It comes from the numbers stamped on the sidewall of the tires that came with the bike from the factory. Use the numbers on the side of the tire. The tire won't flex properly, thus supplying proper grip, otherwise.

[BAMBY]

hmm... I've always been told NOT to inflate tires to the max psi on the side wall... (cars OR bikes)(low prof tires are a different case)
I've got no problems putting the pressure above "honda's recommended psi" but I've never heard of putting the pressure at or above the max on the sidewall.

and as for the dry rotting- i guess im just used to the definition of dryrotting ive come to know from seeing m/c tires in my local junkyard. large cracks, all over the whole tire, easily visible... I suppose it wouldn't hurt to air down the tire(s) tomorrow and see if the cracks will show themselves or not...

if i air it down, and don't see any form of dryrot- what do you think? My reasoning here is that i dont want to buy new tires, and then have them sit on my cold garage floor all winter- that would just speed up the process of the rubber aging i would think.
if my tires are all you're saying they are, then im gonna be in for a world of surprise when i do get these new tires.

[Bumblebee]

hmm... I've always been told NOT to inflate tires to the max psi on the side wall...

Why?

Why have they said that? What is their justification for the reasoning? "Because" with nothing following the single word or "I feel" or glazed over eyes droning on without thought while answering are not valid answers.

and as for the dry rotting- i guess im just used to the definition of dryrotting ive come to know from seeing m/c tires in my local junkyard. large cracks, all over the whole tire, easily visible... I suppose it wouldn't hurt to air down the tire(s) tomorrow and see if the cracks will show themselves or not...

if i air it down, and don't see any form of dryrot- what do you think? My reasoning here is that i dont want to buy new tires, and then have them sit on my cold garage floor all winter- that would just speed up the process of the rubber aging i would think.

I think if you have 7-10 year old tires, they're ready for the old used tire pile without even looking at them.

Cold and dark is far better than hot direct sunlight. UV increases the rate of damage to rubber which is why there are tire covers for spare tires.

Massive cracks you can put your helmet into do not define the initial stages of dry rot. Harder rubber with reduced traction is the first symptom. Then teeny tiny little cracks between the treads or on the sidewalls near lettering. Then it keeps progressing after that with larger and larger cracks and harder lower traction rubber.
The problem with rubber hardening is that subjectively it's difficult to detect without a valid reference point. One day it's good. The next month it's a little less good which since you're riding daily you redefine as the normal standard for good. Then the next month it's less good that's now the defined good..which is now, in reality, two stages removed from what is actually good. Five and six year old tires feel pretty good as long as you don't have a fixed reference point (new tires) to base that handling on. The big step to degrading really gets going when you change tires and notice is at about 3-4 years. The difference is pretty significant.

IMO: At the very first sign of cracks, get rid of the tires or don't ride on them anymore. Even if the tire has never been used with perfect tread, if it has cracks, get rid of them. Sometimes it takes months for the cracks to spread, other times it takes 10 miles to turn them completely unsafe for use. I've seen the remains of 12 year old no cracks tires with zero miles on them that have exploded the first time they got up to 50mph.

if my tires are all you're saying they are, then im gonna be in for a world of surprise when i do get these new tires.

Unless you have magic tires that don't degrade and they're really 7-10 years old, be prepared for a world of surprise. After the release compound is scrubbed off, you'll think the road surface and new tires are made of velcro compared to the ice rink tires you currently have.

[fishmeister]

Other useful information on the tire's sidewall includes its manufacturing date. Look on the side for a raised block with four digits; it's usually next to the U.S. DOT tire identification number. The first two indicate the week of its manufacture, and the last two are for the year. For example, 1702 would indicate the tire was manufactured in April, 2002. Prior to 2000, there were only three digits, with the last one indicating the year.

[fishmeister]

Interesting that Dunlop for example will no longer accept a tire on warranty after four years of manufacture date.

Not accepted if:

"Ozone cracking/weather checking for tires treated with dressings or incompatible cleaning agents or submitted more than 48 months after manufacture."

[BAMBY]

fish- thats good, its how i found out how old my tires were in the first place. I encourage people to check this when they get a new pair of tires- they shouldn't be too old if you just bought them.
well as for the max psi reasoning... some of the people that i have heard this from just "say it" and some of the others say that:
if its the MAX PSI that the people that make the tires put on the sidewall, then the manufacturer probably put that there for a reason- because the tire is under too much pressure when it is at or above the MAX psi... the tire doesnt perform as its supposed to, doesnt absorb shock the way its designed to, wears incorrectly because the center tread wears more quickly.

Direct Quote from Dunlop Motorcycle Tires Website: http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/infocenter_tiretips.asp?id=8#tip
 "Keep in mind that hard cornering, passengers, heavy loads and sustained high speeds will require higher pressures (up to that indicated on the sidewall)."
That's why I said I have no problems putting the pressure above honda's recommendations, but I don't put it at or above the sidewall max psi.

Bumblebee-you bring up another good reason why i had wanted to wait for next season for tires- the release compound is something i would not want to be wearing off when temperatures are cold, let alone conditions wet. because my bike is my transportation for work school etc. i'd rather have to wear that off when it is at least warm out so that i have that going for me in terms of traction. but this is now less important to me because that seems less risky than what you have experienced with some of your tires.
but your reasoning on the age of my tires and what that may lead to is far more convincing than me trying to "get by" till spring- what have i got to loose by getting tires now anyhow. I see your point on this.

if the tires i have now are 'fine' in my opinion for dry weather, then i cant WAIT to see what new (once worn in) tires are like!

[fishmeister]

The whole point is everything may seem fine untill you got nothing under you. Then it's too late. It's not like falling off a bicycle, or getting clipped in a car. You have a great chance of not seeing tomorrow.

[chromy]

also, tire pressure additionally makes a bigg difference! make sure they're up to mfg recommendations for the bike (not the max psi on the sidewall)

yeah I dont really agree with this one. Once you change from stock tires then the amount of air pressure needed will change, it will be somewhere between the bike mfg recommendation and the tire max psi is usually were the right psi will be found. I have run aftermarket tires at the bike mfg suggestion and ended up ruining a very expensive front due to cupping....caused by under-inflation. I will say this, if you have a air comp easily available lowering the air pressure in the tires a few psi when you know you are faces with lower than norm temps or rain can help with traction by allowing the tire to flex more and hence warm up faster.

I'm with you on this one CMyers...  Had wobble problems with my NH in turns until Coffee sugested I inflate to tire spec vs Honda manual spec.  Bike has not wobbled since then.  Definately inflate to tire spec.  

[coffee_brake]

The tire only says what the pressure can be while completely loaded to maximum capacity. I can get 20k miles from a carefully maintained rear tire on my Concours by running a little more than the tire says. I run 50 psi in the back and 45 in the front. On the NH I run 48 in the back and 43 in the front. And I'm a freak about checking the tires regularly; I can't afford to waste a single mile from my rubber, my bikes are my only transportation.

I haven't lost traction on the NH in years, even in the rain. And I always choose my Nighthawk for rainy-day riding, it has extra lights, it's lighter to pick up in case I slip and drop it, and it simply fits me the best; I can control it better under slippery, scary conditions than any other bike I've ever ridden.

I think tire companies want us to run lower pressure so the tire wears earlier. I think the PSI stamped on the tire is too low for one-up, unloaded riding. I think running a higher PSI than that number on the side makes the tire last longer, prevents premature front tire cupping, and does not cause loss of traction (unless you're running like 15 PSI over what the sidewall says).

[gammer]

Jenn, do you not notice more bumpyness or bounce in the front by running higher psi on the front tire? I do on mine.

[coffee_brake]

Only if the PSI is too high. maybe I'm numb...

[ndmeistr]

For those of you who swear by the Frogg Togg brand, do you guys buy it sized to fit over your regular ATTGAT?

I try to buy the size to put over my gear because you have very little protection by itself. It's paper thin although it is extremely effective keeping the wind out.

[Wearyeyed]

Bumping, mainly because I got caught in a MASSIVE storm on the way home from work today.

Thought about going for a little cruise, saw the dark sky to the north, and decided to go south and west; more directly home.

Westbound, the wind picked-up, and scared this sub-500 miler enough to take a u-turn, and head back under a bridge.

Wind died down after a few minutes, and I decided to move on, take another u-turn, and head back west.

Well, I pulled out, and the sky opened up...this being a 4-lane freeway, mind you.

So, with enough power to hold my body to the seat by my sphincter alone, I made the turn, now soaking, and went back to the bridge on the westbound lane.

There I parked the bike, got behind the guard rail, and grabbed a seat and a smoke.

Over the next 30 minutes I watched as half-a-dozen cages periodically joined me under and around the bridge as the skies dumped water like crazy.

Finally, once the rain stopped, I tossed the rain liner under my mesh (mainly to keep me warm having already been soaked) and I headed out.

All I know is that I was terrified the bike would slide out in every turn, and I was quite irritated someone thought it was a good idea to use so much paint on the road....O.o Really, do they need to add "ONLY" to every solid-lined turn lane with an arrow? ;)

While I am SURE I drove FAR below the bike's capabilities (you know, almost getting off and walking the bike around right-hand turns...), I wouldn't mind a little confirmation that, in fact, the bike won't just act like I'm on a skating rink....

[LOKi]

Watch MotoGP. Every once in a while it rains and they don't cancel unless conditions are really bad. Even on a wet track these guys are dragging knees and full on breaks all the way to the apex. There are some offs and you can see how they happen. Usually those painted lines like what you where saying. But those riders are pushing the limits of the motorcycle in the rain beyond how hard you ride on dry pavement.

The bike is a lot more stable than you would think in the rain. In the twisties focus of getting your wight off to the side of the bike instead using all lean. The more you hang off to one side the less you will have to lean the bike in order to make the same turn. That means more contact patch and better traction. YOU can probably push it as hard as you do on dry roads being a n00b and all.   Really just give yourself a little more room to stop and take it a little slower and smother in the turns. Don't wind it up to 7K PRM's as your entering a turn and then WOT (wide open throttle) out of the turn and you should be fine.

OH and   to the forum.